
The images are harrowing: Groups of civilians, armed with military-style assault rifles, storming a state legislature and participating in protests in order to dismantle measures designed to fight an epidemic. The President is egging them on. To other countries, this is pure madness and a sign of profound dysfunctionality as a small, aggressive, and vocal minority is allowed to violate orders, such as safe distancing, installed by duly-elected leaders who have consulted with medical authorities in developing the measures.
Does the Second Amendment allow any individual to carry a firearm into any setting for any purpose? Does the Constitution permit an individual to brandish a firearm (wave it in a threatening manner)? Are guns allowed at protests?
The Second Amendment (SA) of the US Constitution reads:
“A well-regulated Militia, necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”
The SA was interpreted by the courts for over two centuries as the right to bear arms only within the context of militia service. In 2008, the US Supreme Court in District of Columbia v. Heller ruled for the first time that individuals had the right to own an operable gun in their homes for protection. However, writing for the majority in the 5-4 decision, Justice Antonin Scalia—a hunter and a conservative—made it clear that this right was not unlimited and that laws regulating the carrying of firearms, denying gun ownership to felons and the mentally ill, and prohibiting the carrying of dangerous and unusual weapons did not violate the Second Amendment. The Heller majority noted that historically “commentators and courts routinely explained that the right was not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose.” Since Heller, an overwhelming majority of Second Amendment challenges to gun laws have been rejected by the courts.
In 1991, Warren E. Burger, the conservative chief justice of the Supreme Court, asserted that the SA “has been the subject of one of the greatest pieces of fraud—I repeat the word ‘fraud’—on the American public by special interest groups that I have ever seen in my lifetime.” He stated that it does not guarantee the right to private ownership. Instead its purpose was to ensure that militias would be maintained for the defense of the state.
Michael Waldman, president of the Brennan Center for Justice and author of The Second Amendment: A Biography, notes that the phrase “bear arms” in the 18th century referred to military activities. According to Waldman, James Madison’s notes from the Constitutional Convention did not contain a single word about an individual’s right to a gun for self-defense or recreation. Gun laws throughout the country regulated everything from the storage of gunpowder to the carrying of weapons and courts consistently upheld these restrictions. Four times between 1876 and 1939, the U.S. Supreme Court declined to rule that the Second Amendment protected individual gun ownership outside of a militia. From 1888, when law review articles were first indexed, through 1959, every single article on the Second Amendment concluded it did not guarantee an individual right to a firearm.
However, in recent decades, the National Rifle Association launched a campaign, including funding research promoting the narrative that the SA guaranteed a right of Americans to acquire guns outside of militia service. This campaign has convinced most Americans that such a right exists.
The landmark 2008 Heller ruling took the position that the SA protects a right to self-defense in the home—period. Gun carrying in public, carrying in sensitive settings (e.g., government buildings, schools), and possession of “dangerous and unusual” weapons could still be regulated.
Despite the views of constitutional scholars and historians, as well as the limits placed on gun rights by the Supreme Court, over the last 30 years, states have reversed historical trends by adopting right-to-carry laws and 45 allow for the open carrying of firearms.
However, states have a number of tools to avoid the repetition of the spectacle in Michigan’s Capitol, which arguably represents a frontal attack on democracy and the rule of law. States can set limits with regard to the manner, settings, and contexts in which guns can be carried. The most obvious thing a state can do is to prohibit open carrying of firearms in government buildings. For example, North Carolina prohibits the carrying of firearms into government buildings and at protests. Virginia prohibits gun carrying in certain cities, as well as places of worship, courthouses, and airport terminals. However, 36 states either explicitly allow concealed and/or open carry at rallies, or do not forbid guns in that setting — and also preempt localities from passing their own laws to keep firearms away from rallies.
States can also prohibit the brandishing of firearms. In Michigan, legislators felt threatened by armed civilians who stormed the State Capitol. The intimidation ultimately forced a subsequent session to be shut down to prevent a repeat of the incident. Michigan does have a statute that prohibits brandishing, the pointing or displaying of a firearm “in a threatening manner with the intent to induce fear in another person.” This statute was not enforced that day.
In 14th century England, the “Statute of Northampton,” prohibited carrying pistols and daggers in public — whether “secretly” or in the “open” … “to the terror of all people professing to travel and live peaceably.” The prohibition was adopted by the American colonies, such that, for instance, Massachusetts passed a law barring residents from going out to “ride or go armed offensively, to the fear or terror of the good citizens of this Commonwealth.” By the mid-19th century, 17 states adopted laws against weapons carrying that resembled North Carolina’s “going armed to the terror of the public” law. Saul Cornell, a legal historian, explained that the rationale underlying such laws was a balancing of gun rights and public safety.
Jeff Welty, a Professor of Public Law and Government with the University of North Carolina, notes that “going armed to the terror of the public” laws are designed to deal with situations in which people with firearms are menacing others in public and appear to be at risk of committing crimes. The laws allow for police intervention at the sight of worrisome gun carrying, without requiring that officers wait until a shot is fired.
It is important to realize that gun rights today are flourishing in America when compared with the past. The carrying of concealed weapons was outlawed in 40 states by the end of the 1800s. Research conducted by John Donohue of Stanford University shows that right-to-carry laws undermine public safety, increasing homicide rates. Now we see individuals pushing the boundaries of these carry laws—purportedly enacted for self-defense–and intimidating members of the public and even elected leaders. Will the political will be there to put an end to this conduct and preserve our democracy?
May 21, 2020 @ 13:03:59
Right on Brother!
May 21, 2020 @ 16:45:57
Has Donohoe published his tome after peer review? Last I saw it was not, and furthermore, its an association, not proof of cause vs. effect. One can reasonably question whether the tail is wagging the dog here. Lawful carriers do not go around shooting people. Mike has had his own somewhat sour comments on John’s so called research which to me, resembled throwing fifty states into a computer synthetic model and pretending to have sound statistical results, not to mention meaningful cause and effect.
I have a good friend in Michigan, a good Democrat and Progressive on most issues. I asked him about the armed demonstration and he shrugged it off. Michigan is an open carry state, its an exaggeration to say the capitol was “stormed” and no one was charged.
New Mexico is an open carry state. We recently had the legislators pass a rule that you could not take guns into hearing rooms on gun laws, but you can parade around outside. So far no one has taken this to either extreme in search of trouble. The red flag bill debates were spirited but unarmed other than by law enforcement. Whew.
Talked about Michigan the other day with a friend who was a combat veteran of Vietnam, a retired Navy SEAL and a conservative but not a big fan of DJT. We agreed that the protestors in Michigan looked like idiots and didn’t do either gun rights or conservatives any favors. But let’s not exaggerate either. Michigan can change its law if the people wish, as California did after the Panthers marched on the State Capital (Mulford Act). Or, if someone really felt the protestors were brandishing, they could have been arrested. No, they just looked stupid.
May 21, 2020 @ 19:56:44
Hi Khal,
Yes, Donohue has published his work in a peer-reviewed journal:
https://law.stanford.edu/publications/right-to-carry-laws-and-violent-crime-a-comprehensive-assessment-using-panel-data-and-a-state-level-synthetic-controls-analysis/
A number of legislators reported being intimidated and a subsequent session of the legislature was cancelled. This should not be in a democracy. I believe strongly that gun carrying in a legislature, especially openly, should be prohibited. Elected officials should be able to conduct the peoples’ business without feeling intimidated. The protesters also failed to obey an order to distance safely. Otherwise, I’m all for lawful protest.
These folks reflect very poorly on all gun owners and conservatives. I would like to see these groups denounce them.
May 21, 2020 @ 19:38:52
BE CAREFUL FOR WHAT YOU ASK.
My assumption is that Tom Gabor would desire only police officers be armed. Could be wrong…(you know what they say about assuming)
But if my assumption is correct be careful for what you wish.
It doesn’t take long to find out that police officers have about a 15% hit probability in a gunfight. (Not going to get into the definition of a gunfight, most people will understand the point)
This 15% hit probability doesn’t take into consideration of how many citizenry are being “shot up.” In 2013 New York Police Department had two officers shoot and kill a murderer. Unfortunately they also shot nine bystanders.
It also doesn’t take long to research and find shooting innocent bystanders is not uncommon. This is not an anomaly.
If one does take the time and research police officers shootings I believe they would find that:
Most police officers are not gun guys or girls. They own few, if any firearms and seldom, if ever, practice.
Most police officers fire their handguns only once a year for mandatory qualications. They clean their handguns less often.
Most qualification courses have generous passing scores, involve only stationary targets. And officers are allowed to shoot as many times as necessary to pass. (Question to ask police departments, sheriff offices, and state police, how many sworn officers fail to qualify with their firearm? Have officers ever been terminated for failue to qualify?) I believe you will find the answer very difficult to get, if at all. Most agencies will have ZERO officers terminated, if they are willing to answer.
Many law enforcement agencies use only cheaper practice ammunition for qualification. This ammunition produce much less muzzle flash, recoil and report than duty ammunition.
Many political forces are generally virulently anti-gun, and do not have an appreciation of the importance of their officers being proficient until law suits are filed against the officer and their agency.
All of this only apply with officers willing to enter a gun fight. I give you Scot Peterson, Broward County Sheriff’s Office, Officer Cordell Hendrex, Las Vegas Police Department, to name a couple of more than people realize. After all police have no duty to protect individuals.
When you call police for help I hope you get one who knows which end of their firearm is for social work. Be careful for what you ask.
May 21, 2020 @ 20:09:55
Thanks for your comment Alan.
No, I’m not advocating for disarming the population and realize that police officers have a dismal hit rate in combat situations.
This said, my quarrel is with a heavily armed group, representing a very small fraction of the population, that is allowed to carry their weaponry into a legislature and intimidate elected officials. If this were to happen on a routine basis the democracy would be in grave peril. Imagine if armed groups with different points of view ended up at the legislature at the same time. We would be going down a dangerous road.
As for armed self-defense, yes I would like to have a well-trained armed person next to me if I was attacked. However, when we look overall and I have reviewed the evidence in great depth, firearms are used far more often to attack or intimidate than they are used in self-defense. I also have an issue with the sham training that exists around the country for those applying for carry permits. I’ve taken it myself in Florida–a 90 minute course taken one time and 5 shots down the range at a paper target while the instructor is holding your hand. No test of knowledge retention or marksmanship. And about a dozen states require no training at all!
May 21, 2020 @ 20:21:17
Anyone remember the characters taking their plastic gun babies to restaurants ? The fad passed and my bet is this one will too. The best to way to end this fad is for the news people to stop making the clowns important.
May 21, 2020 @ 21:42:52
Mr. Gabor, I find it would be irresponsible of me to depend on another, police officer or a well-trained person, for my safety or the safety of a member of my family if attacked. It is for this reason I’ve been trained since my days in the military over 50 years ago. I’ve carried a firearm most everyday since. I’ve even fired my firearm more than once in anger. It is for this reason that I constantly seek training and go to a range frequently.
I believe the family members of those who were injured and killed in Parkland would have liked a well-trained person next to their family member when a gunman opened fire on February 14, 2018. Oh…they did, his name was Scot Peterson, and others who felt it was more important to set up a perimeter around the school. I’m not a betting man but when it comes to my safety or the safety of my family, I believe there is only one person I can trust…me. I refuse to put the life of a family member in the hands of a stranger.
I also believe that there are people who shouldn’t carry a gun. Maybe you are one of those people. I dont know, but don’t take that right away from those who desire to own firearms.
You say that firearms are used far more often to attack or intimidate than used in self-defense. Don’t know if the CDC would agree.
I’ve seen prior posts authored by you in this magazine and believe your position is not just with the small faction of the population, that is allowed to carry their weaponry into a legislature and intimidate elected officials. Would you say the same thing about motorcycle groups (gangs) who show up, in their colors, when helmet laws are being discussed by the legislature? (4990 motorcycle facilities in the US in 2017) It is for nothing but intimidating those law makers. But I still support their right to be there. After all this is what so many of my friend fought for…freedom
May 21, 2020 @ 23:49:36
Alan, I am grateful for your service and am sure you are well trained and can defend yourself and your family. However, just in Florida, there are 2 million people with concealed weapons permits and I would wager that the majority have no military service and little if any real training. We also have a very weak background check system so I would not want to be anywhere near them in a firefight.
I do not wish to disarm Americans. But I believe that carrying lethal weapons is a sacred trust and only those with a thorough military or law enforcement training–not by a business–and thoroughly vetted should have a permit to carry.
May 22, 2020 @ 00:32:54
Mr. Gabor, we could discuss/debate this topic for a long time and I don’t believe I would or could change your position, and I know you could never change my mine.
So I will end with just these few words…
I just hope and pray that if you or a member of your family is ever involved in a life changing event and there’s a need for law enforcement to be called that you get a police officer that has a hit ratio better than 15%. And if someone like Scot Peterson shows up…RUN.
Also, if you or one of your family members are a bystander during a shooting with police and “bad guy(s)” hope you/they have the presence of mind to hide.
I hope there is no psychological projection of those 2 million people with Florida concealed weapon permits.
P.S. FYI, firefight are often small-scale military battles. Small-arms battles between say police or CW permit holders are called a shootout or a gunfight.
Respectfully,
May 22, 2020 @ 10:07:15
I left a long, ornery rant last night with two hot links (to a RAND page and to Phil Cook’s home page) so it is probably hung up in spam, which is probably where it belongs. A few major points.
One, while folks like Phil Cook will hire researchers to investigate actual people who are in jail for illegal guns (the Cook County study) and write papers about real information, Donohoe collects state level crime numbers and stirs them into a computer program and creates synthetic comparisons of stuff that may have nothing to do with causation. Garbage In/Garbage Out. Gary Kleck wrote a response to that study saying it was overblown. At best it shows state to state correlations, no causations. Even Donohoe admits that some states are simply more violent than others due to cultural differences. But that’s buried in that fiftysomething page tome.
Rand Corp. has a whole series of gun research pages, many updated in April. They say at best, only a few studies go beyond inconclusive “meh”. For example, for all the talk about how SYG laws make for more shootings, they point out that the alleged calculated number of added shootings in two SYG states, FL and TX, are more than the total number of justifiable homicides in the fifty states. So obviously, something besides SYG law is going on. Besides, does anyone really believe that shooters are law students who study changes in law and then decide to go shoot someone? I’m not fond of making it easy to justify blowing someone away, but when GVP advocates focus on every shiny new object, its detracts from credibility.
About a quarter of American households own guns. There are roughly 100,000 shootings per year, many caused by the same old people for the same old reasons. That’s been discussed here. So we are trying to weed out considerably less than 0.1% of people with guns who go around shooting each other from the considerably more than 99.9% that never misuse them. One can try to find the needles in the haystack via random variables as Donohoe or Webster advocate, or get rid of the haystack as Mike has suggested. But if you don’t live in a free fire zone in some part of Philly or Chicago or have a bedmate with an alcohol, drug, or anger problem, shootings are incredibly rare events in a nation of a third of a billion people.
Conversely, we can focus enforcement on high risk individuals but you know what the civil liberties people say. Whether red flag laws or doing computer models of linked high risk cohorts a la Papachristos and having the cops visit the likely offenders, “you’re violating my rights”. Yah, sure, you betcha….your rights stop when your bullet goes whizzing past my nose.
May 23, 2020 @ 13:48:51
It may be that firearm misuses are few in number relative to the number of owners or firearms out there. However, their misuse often has dire consequences–about 40,000 gun-related deaths per year. The odds of an American being murdered with a gun are over 30 times that of a German or Brit and 300 times greater than that of a resident of Japan.
Gun deaths are not confined to thugs in the inner city. Every year, hundreds of thousands of US women are threatened or shot at by abusive partners wielding guns. Most of these cases are never reported. We also have a surge in suicides by firearm among working class males.
About 500 kids are shot a year in Florida alone, many due to careless uses, poor storage, and laws that encourage lethal force.
This volume of preventable deaths are not so insignificant.
May 25, 2020 @ 11:42:56
” Every year, hundreds of thousands of US women are threatened or shot at by abusive partners wielding guns. Most of these cases are never reported. ”
If these are not reported, where do those numbers come from and how reliable are they? That kind of statement raises an, um….red flag.
Questions 11h and 11i on the BATF 4473 form prohibit those convicted of misdemeanor domestic violence from buying a gun. Red flag laws, if written to preserve due process, can secure guns from a loose cannon who is a threat to self or others. I hear the red flag law is used thousands of times in Florida.
We’ve been a little bit careful in New Mexico, at least so far, in focusing gun violence prevention laws on those who demonstrate they can’t be trusted rather than on everybody (UBCs,red flag law). By contrast on the coasts, a stroke of a liberal governor’s pen can make felons out of those who never raised a finger, no less a gun, to harm others. New Jersey comes to mind. I hear a lot about how some states are damned for their weak gun laws. I don’t hear a peep out of the usual suspects (Brady, Moms, Everytown, Giffords) about how ridiculously over the top states like NJ are prime examples of why gun owners don’t trust gun controllers. If anything they like it that way. But ask Shaneen Allen what she thinks. At least she got a pardon. From a Republican.
So I put a curse on both houses. As far as I am concerned, the hyperbole is good for raising funds but not for improving anything.
May 22, 2020 @ 10:11:32
Thanks Alan. We can still respect and learn from each other even if it doesn’t lead to a wholesale change in our thinking.
Respect back.
Tom
May 25, 2020 @ 22:51:58
Khal, they come from large surveys, such as https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/181867.pdf. There are millions (about 5) of intimate partner assaults each year in the country and about 4% of all women report being threatened or assaulted with a gun at some point.
May 26, 2020 @ 11:39:23
Thanks for the reference. So there is actually a source, even though its a poll source rather than police records so there is no way of validating.
I’m not doubting it goes on and is a major issue. Which is why I said I support those laws such as background checks that rely on good data being reported to the NICS system and the red flag laws.
I’m a little surprised that Susan Sorenson’s name didn’t come up anywhere in that document. That’s her field at the Ortner Center. I imagine you are familiar with this link!
http://www.ortnercenter.org/people/faculty-investigators/susan-sorenson
May 26, 2020 @ 22:29:41
Yes, that is another source. Good victimization surveys are often viewed as more valid and certainly more inclusive than police records.